The Role of a Postpartum Doula with LaVita Brown of Gold Coast Doulas.

Kristin Revere and LaVita Brown discuss the day in the life of a daytime and overnight doula. LaVita shares multiple examples of what her days look supporting families in West Michigan.  

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Transcript

Kristin Revere and LaVita Brown discuss the day in the life of a daytime and overnight doula.  LaVita shares multiple examples of what her days look supporting families in West Michigan.  

Hello, hello!  This is Kristin Revere with Ask the Doulas, and I’ve got a very special episode today, bringing on one of our own Gold Coast doulas, LaVita Brown.  I can’t wait to tell you all about LaVita.  She is a certified postpartum and infant care doula who has a love for mother and infant bonding.  She understands the demands a new infant brings and is devoted to help ensure a smooth transition of baby adjusting to their new home, as well as helping mothers receive the rest and care they deserve.  LaVita is often called the baby whisperer because she has a calm, nurturing presence that helps parents feel comfortable and at ease. 

She believes it should be an enjoyable time and strives to make getting settled in with your bundle of joy as comfortable as possible.  LaVita provides the most current information on infant soothing and feeding techniques.  She is there to support you and your baby’s needs without judgment and believes you know your baby best and supports your decisions. 

Welcome, LaVita! 

Thank you so much, Kristin, for this opportunity.  So glad to chat with you today. 

Yes, it is always lovely to hear about the role of a postpartum doula from one of our own doulas because I feel like it’s a different experience for every family because they all have different goals.  So it’s not a job where it’s the same every day.  Even a nanny role can be similar, but the postpartum doula role is quite unique.  So I would love to hear your take on that. 

Absolutely.  I was thinking about that last night, how the doula role and the nanny role have similarities and just how much of a privilege it is that families open their home for help and they trust me with their newborn.  I truly see it as a gift.  I love how I can help mom and baby adjust, the baby to adjust to the outside world and get settled in with mom and dad.  I love to see that bond between mom and baby. 

Yes, and I feel like doulas come in to their work either based on a love for babies and wanting to mother the mother, or their own personal experience, especially birth doulas on our team, whether it was an amazing experience and they want to support other clients, or if they had some trials along the way in their labor or a NICU baby or a similar experience to mine where I had preeclampsia and had a NICU baby and struggles with feeding, with breastfeeding.  So I wanted to help other moms.  Why did you get into the work? 

Absolutely, yes.  I hear that a lot from others.  Whenever I tell someone that I am a doula, they go into their story.  And for me, it was pretty much the same.  I had my children back when there wasn’t a lot of help, and I needed a lot of support.  I just remember I was up all night.  I had a three-year-old and a two-year-old, and I decided to work an evening job because I was up with them anyway.  I was like, I might as well be up all night and go ahead and work a job.  When I would come home in the mornings, though, my husband at the time, he got a kick out of waking up the kids purposely, so I would have no rest.  So he would leave for work, so that means that small little nap that I thought I could grab once I got off work, it was not happening at all. 

There was one day I was tired, the kids were whining, I was crying, and I was really needing some help, and I had reached quite a low.  And I remember going to the Yellow Pages, and I’m looking for some help.  I actually happened to stumble upon a psychotherapist, and I was like, hmm, maybe I could be one of those.  So I began my career as an educator.  I wanted to be a therapist. 

What happened was I ended up moving back to Michigan, and in our National Awakenings magazine, I saw an ad for Sanity Savers.  So I looked it up.  I went to the orientation, and that’s when I discovered Moms Bloom.  And I thought it was such an exciting field, that you could actually sit with a baby, help the mom out, do some light housework, tidy up, do some laundry, that sort of thing, but really be there to support the moms.  And that’s what began my journey right there.  I began to look into see how I could be certified in order to do this job. 

So for our listeners who are out of West Michigan, Moms Bloom is a nonprofit that brings in volunteers into the home to do some of the roles that a trained and certified postpartum doula would do, but it is more of a helper.  Almost like a mother’s helper in a way, and it’s very needed and is covered by grants.  So there is no fee involved.  I actually used Moms Bloom with both of my children because postpartum doulas weren’t really a thing in my area.  And it was very helpful to have that support. 

Absolutely.  It’s funny because when you get there, they’re so surprised that you’re actually there, and they’re like, well, what do I do now?  And that’s when we go into, take a shower.  Get something to eat – have you eaten today?  If you want to, go take a walk.  They kind of find it hard to let go, but after a while, they just seem to pick right up, and then they’re like, clean this for me.  Can you do that?  Can you watch my two-year-old?  They really enjoy it.  I was so grateful to find it. 

Yes, we do sibling care, as you mentioned.  We support feedings, so if our client has a breastfeeding question or is struggling with their pump or storing milk, we help with all types of feeding, including formula feeding, and help with sleep shaping.  We do have sleep consultants on our team, and that is a much different field.  They come up with a plan, and postpartum doulas can help implement a sleep consulting plan, but we’re not sleep consultants.  But we understand healthy infant sleep and how to shape both naptime and the overnight rest.  And you provide both day and overnight postpartum support at Gold Coast.  Some of our team members love one or the other, but you happen to be one that can speak on both, so I would love to hear your take on the typical overnight role of a postpartum doula. 

Sure.  So on the overnight side, I almost like to think of it as I do everything backwards.  Where in the morning, you start out with a delicious cup of coffee, I more or less do that at night.  So I have my coffee, get myself together.  I have a little doula bag that has my little materials and things in it.  I’ll check my schedule to make sure I go to the right home, and I get to the home, and the first thing I like to do is sit down and talk with mom and dad just to find out how the day went, and were there any challenges?  Was there anything I need to look forward to in the evening?  Do they have any questions, any concerns?  And so we kind of iron that out.  I find out when the baby’s last feeding was and what they’re looking for in the evening. 

Then a lot of times, they like to stay up and talk, but I’ll shoo them off to bed, so they give their last kisses to the babies and eventually they go on off to bed.  Then I step right in and handle baby.  Usually it’s about time for the baby’s first evening feeding, and I’ll make sure the baby’s changed, get the bottles ready, go ahead and feed the baby.  It’s such an enjoyable time to be able to play and talk.  Most babies, they’ve slept most of the day, so they like to stay up with me, so we’ll have our little conversations.  And they’ll tell me what mommy and daddy did that day and what they liked and didn't like.  There’s usually laundry or something to do, so I’ll do some light laundry.  I’ll fold up things.  I’ll restock diapers, clean and sanitize bottles for them, get the kitchen nice and tidy.  And I like to make sure everything is good for the next day.  And I just sit up with the baby all night. 

Usually, the feedings, it’s about two or three during my shift, and then around about quarter till, usually the moms or dads are up and ready to take over.  I like to make sure the baby’s already fed and that I can prepare them to be fresh and well-rested the next morning.  I never leave with the baby screaming.  Every time I leave – in fact, a lot of the moms will say, oh, she’s quiet now, but as soon as you leave, she’ll start crying.  And so I like to leave them in a good state of mind so that they’re prepared for their day and ready for me by the time I come back. 

I currently watch twins, and I love how the parents will say, no matter how bad the day is, we always look forward and know LaVita’s coming tonight.  So that kind of makes me feel good. 

You’ve got it and we can rest!  And we do work with a lot of twins and occasionally a triplet family at Gold Coast.  Some doulas are a little nervous to work with twins, but you do not hesitate and had experience prior to Gold Coast.  It’s all about schedules and trying to get twins to leap and feed and all of it on schedule, and that can be a little overwhelming for parents.  But when they have an expert talking about tips and evidence-based resources so they can make informed decisions for how they plan not only their nights, but also their days with their twins or solo child. 

Exactly, and as you mentioned, what I find as challenging and something that I continue to improve daily is scheduling and staying on top of it.  You have to really plan ahead and just be ready, especially with twins, because the parents will say, well, this one will wake up first.  This one will wake up next.  But a lot of times, it doesn’t go that way.  And so I base myself on the baby’s cues.  Maybe the other one will wake up before the one that they originally thought would awaken.  So it’s just being on top of it, having those bottles ready, and being ready to go. 

Yes.  There are some different roles related to the doula field, and it is much different.  There’s the common term night nanny or night nurse and newborn care specialist and overnight postpartum doula.  And then there’s also, of course, family and friends and mother’s helpers during the day.  So in your opinion, how is a postpartum doula different than a night nanny? 

I would say the difference is, for me, mostly staying overnight.  A nighttime nanny will stay at the home and wake up the next day.  They’re pretty much living with the family.  That would probably be the only difference I could see because I would do the same roles that a nanny would do as a postpartum doula.  I mean, I would do the same roles as a nanny, caring for the baby and making sure that the parents are sleeping. 

I wonder, too, though, if the relationship between a nanny and a doula is a little different where the children grow up with that nanny, seeing her every single day and every single night.  A lot of children will grow with that nanny and the nanny will end up taking them to school and they just kind of grow with the family, whereas after three months or so, my role would kind of end.  It kind of phases out.  But there are a lot of similarities.  Making sure the baby gets to bed, that the parents sleep.  The chores that are needed to be done around the house, preparing the meals.  I think that might be something different as well where the nanny would prepare meals for the family, more than just the baby. 

Yeah, in our daytime role, we do light meal preparation and snacks, but we’re not making dinner the way some nannies are also household managers.  I would say in my opinion, it is different because of our training and our background.  A nanny may have just babysat and usually is required by families to have CPR and first aid, like we are, both infant and adult.  But they have not taken formal training to understand newborn sleep.  They do not support the parents in recovery after a birth, the mother, and don’t fully understand how to support breastfeeding or pumping.  They can certainly formula feed or feed pumped milk, but they are not experts in feeding or healthy sleep habits and may not have the formal training or the continued education.  Now, some nannies are also newborn care specialists and have taken additional training.  They may have even taken sleep, and as you mentioned, a daytime nanny, especially a live-in, could be more long term.  Sometimes night nannies or a night nurse, they would be more of a 24/7, like temporary assignment and not necessarily stay with the kids.  And newborn care specialists – I happen to be one – it has replaced the term night nanny and night nurse, especially the night nurse term.  Oftentimes, night nurses were not registered nurses.  They just used that term.  But there are some nurses who take more of a medical role, especially with NICU babies, and carry different licensing than, say, a doula would.  We’re insured, and we are certified.  But even the nurses on our team do not act in the scope of a nurse when they’re in the postpartum doula role.  They’re acting in the scope of a doula, similar to our team members who are also certified lactation consultants.  If they’re there, they will certainly give their expertise in feeding, but if a client wanted a consultation with them, they would hire them separately and not use their hours as a postpartum doula to meet about specific lactation concerns. 

That is true.  We come more with resources, and as you said, because we’re not licensed as a nurse or whatever, we don’t give advice as a nurse.  We can’t give medical advice.  But we can – based upon our training and what we know, we can offer suggestions and solutions in that manner.  And if a client has a concern, say a tongue tie, we know the different referrals, whether it’s an IBCLC on our team or referring out to a pediatric dentist or a craniosacral therapist.  We understand all of the area resources for not only pregnancy but also the postnatal phase.  And you mentioned, yes, we typically work in the first three months.  At Gold Coast, we do extend to the first year because we support a lot of families who have demanding careers and need sleep after their leave ends or their partner is, say, a physician or a manager of a company and travels quite a bit.  So sometimes clients don’t even want to let us go after the year mark.  They continue to add on hours and stuff.  

Yes, because they get attached, similar to the way a family would with a nanny.  We are part of such a beautiful and intimate time in life and often an overwhelming and anxiety-filled time.  As you said, it’s a gift to be allowed into their space and to care for their baby or, with multiple babies, the twins and triplets. 

Yes, yes, that’s so true.  I find it’s such a growing field, as well.  There’s always more to learn.  And I really admire you and the different letters after your name and all the training that you have, and I aspire to be that way, as well, and just check out and do all the trainings that I can to stay on top of this field because it’s ever changing.  There’s always something new to learn. 

It is, and with different fertility insurances covering doulas, I feel like the standard of care has been up from when I became a doula over 12 years ago.  Since Gold Coast started ten years ago, I’ve always required doulas to be certified, to have first aid and CPR, to have their own business, an LLC, to do continued education, and that liability insurance is important.  And then they’re able to track their own expenses and their mileage and buy any necessities for their work or pay for trainings and write those off as a business owner.  And so the things that I’ve always required are now required for doulas because of these fertility benefits.  They’re wanting certified doulas.  They’re requiring insurance.  They’re requiring first aid.  And we have always had that standard because I wanted a seamless experience for families because we work with a lot of families that need more than what one doula can provide, especially with overnight.  So you’ve worked with families that have seven of our doulas on their team, and you all communicate well about how the night went, give tips on sleep and feeding to each other, and you try to have it be as seamless as possible.  If the doulas went through a completely different certification program, they may have learned different things.  By having the continued education be standard, it doesn’t matter who is in the home.  We’re going to try to act as one.  Would you agree with that? 

Oh, absolutely, and that’s one thing I love about our agency.  I did my original training through DONA International, and while I lived in Atlanta, I ran into ProDoula International.  And I just really enjoyed Randy’s take – Randy Patterson, who is the owner and founder of that, and her book.  I just really loved how she talks about her business, how she started basically from the ground up, right?  And just really grew it into this really wonderful empire and just how the website and everything is so seamless and how we can – that’s how I found you!  And I was able just to go on there and find different doulas all around the different states, where we can sign up and be a part of it.  And each of you follow that model of making sure we have our CPR.  We have that insurance.  And making it accessible and easy for us to do it.  I find it just makes me feel more polished, more professional, because I can really say, yes, I have a business that I run, and I’m learning from the best.  So I love that. 

Well, I always say it’s about not only empowering and supporting clients, but my heart and the reason I do this work is all about women, the mothers, the matrescence journey.  And so if I didn't support my team and their own growth and goals, then I’m not necessarily supporting women.  Our team members have taken extended medical leaves and maternity leaves.  We’ve had some go on to be homebirth midwives or labor and delivery nurses or lactation consultants within the hospital.  It makes them feel like they’re not alone, because this work is lonely, whether you’re a birth doula or a postpartum doula.  When I had a solo practice, I had other doula friends and we would meet up, but it’s not the same as being on a team and knowing in the middle of the night that there are other doulas on your team who may have an answer to a question about a colicky baby.  And we have a communication platform, and I often see messages between doulas, like, so, have you ever encountered this?  What suggestions can I offer this client?  And so you feel like there’s a community within a team model.  So for listeners who are expecting, or who are in pre-conception and planning, there are many choices.  There are individual doulas or night nannies or agencies or collectives.  So thinking about what is best for you, but I find that the work is more sustainable if you can plan to take a holiday off, like Labor Day, for example, or make sure that you’re not working on your child’s birthday.  Even our birth doulas have the option of sharing call with a partner.  Our postpartum doulas have backup if they’re ill or if there’s an emergency so the client has a choice of being supported and not going without the care if they really need someone, day or night.

Right, and making sure to take care of themselves, because our self-care is very important, as well.  We don’t want to burn out because then we’re no good for the families. 

Right, and overnights especially can be tough.  The lack of sleep and having a different sleep schedule – we do rest when the baby or babies are resting, but with newborns, there’s not much rest.  And as you mentioned, we’re cleaning bottle parts, tidying up the nursery, and leaving things better than what we find most of the time, if baby allows us to do household tasks. 

Yes! 

So that is something that we also talk about a lot is self-care and taking time if needed.  Before I do the matchmaking with families who are looking for team members like yourself, I look at what they’re looking for in experience, what their goals are, and availability.  But I’m also very clear – like, for example, if you have time off during Christmas, I’ll let the client know that LaVita is available for these dates, but she does have a vacation planned in this time, and I have other doulas, but she could be your primary.  So we try to think so far ahead of time because clients, even postpartum clients, will hire us quite early.  Some won’t call me until baby has been born and they need help that night, and we get those.  But there are also the planners, especially those with some of those fertility benefits to use, that know they want two to three months of support and someone three nights a week or seven nights a week.  And so I want to make sure that the doulas are rested enough to fully care for the child and there’s not a risk to themselves or baby by being really tired.  And our mental health can decline if we’re not getting sleep.  Same with birth doulas with long births and being on call. 

I just opened my email a couple days ago and there was another lead you had sent me, and they’re already planning for a baby in January.  And I’m like, wow, I love those planners ahead of time.  I have time now.  I can do the interview and we can prepare and I can make sure my schedule is open and be ready for them.  I love the preparation.  I love it. 

And with our birth doulas, we’re talking about spring break plans and thinking ahead out into May and availability.  And before we know it, it will be summer baby due dates.  So there certainly is a lot more planning, but people are becoming more and more aware of the benefits of a postpartum doula.  It’s not just for celebrities and the elite.  Everyone deserves support. 

Everyone, yes. 

The work is so needed.  It was always done; it just wasn’t a paid profession. 

Exactly, and that was one of the things that caught me.  I can get paid and do this?  And I also love – from when I started to now, I can say what I am.  I’m an overnight doula, postpartum doula.  And they know what I am now.  Oh, I had one, or my sister had one.  And being here in Michigan, they’ll say that they had one here or they know of Gold Coast Doulas.  That is also very heartwarming and good to hear. 

I feel like that’s a lot to do with our community involvement and giving to hospital foundations and charitable organizations.  You just worked on a community baby shower event at a table.  We are out there and very involved in our community, and even our office in East Town – I’ve served on the board of the East Town Business Association, so supporting our local communities, supporting low income women and children, especially with our diaper drive, the 10th Annual.  It is helpful for families to know that they’re giving to an organization that not only upholds high standards of care and also cares about the community, and I want the doulas like yourself on our team to get paid what they’re worth, so I don’t offer free postpartum support or sliding scale, but we do so much giving with our diaper drive and to organizations and foundations that serve low income women and children that it allows the doulas to feel like we’re all giving back and helping without compromising our own family needs and our own needs to pay our bills.  

Yes.  Absolutely. 

And I think that’s important with women doing women’s work that is often undervalued, and I do appreciate how society is valuing the work of birth and postpartum doulas more and more, especially with the addition of some of these benefits and realizing that families need more support than ever before with the demands.  I feel like technology has made us need to be on more, and I find that clients are not fully on leave because you can still access your work emails and get texts.  There’s not a way to fully decompress with how wired society is right now. 

Yes.  And even with COVID, the pandemic, more people are working from home.  I still feel that a lot of the moms that work from home, they still need that time away from home and baby.  Get outside.  Go somewhere by yourself.  But I love how the workforce is being – I believe they’re being a bit more understanding in the field of mom and baby, allowing more time off and being more supportive of them. 

Yes, and longer paternity leaves than ever before, which is so helpful.  But we’re still not comparing to Europe where you can get a year off. 

Wouldn’t that be nice! 

It would be amazing.  But that’s why doulas and nonprofits like Moms Bloom and other services – there are some home visiting services that do offer additional assistance.  

So what is your favorite piece of advice to give to a client? 

My favorite piece of advice is to just relax.  I often tell, when I go into interviews or my first night with the families, I let them know that they’ve got it, that it’s just a natural instinct, and I’m basically there to just support and help grow that relationship that they have with their baby.  A lot of times they’ll say, “I don’t know what I’m doing!”  But I encourage them that they do know what they’re doing.  And I always let them know they’re doing amazing and just give them that push and that encouragement.  I find it just really helps them to relax a bit more. 

Excellent.  How do doulas support partners or fathers? 

My main focus is always the moms, but then I also love the dads, as well.  Most of the time, the dads will be like, well, the baby doesn’t want to be with me, or the baby loves mom because mom carried the baby for nine months.  So dad – I encourage dad and let him know, hey, you’ve got this, and the family I’m watching now, every time I go in the evening, dad has the baby, and dad is sitting up cuddling with the baby and it’s just amazing.  He’s like, yes, she’s a daddy’s girl.  And I’m like, absolutely.  Watching dad be there for mom and really just understanding her needs and stepping in and doing things that mom can’t do, just being her support, is one of the things that I love watching the dads do. 

I love that, as well.  And so what are your thoughts on how doulas interact seamlessly with other family members?  Sometimes there are family members living in houses that we are supporting our clients in, or our clients may be staying with a family member and could be living – say, in California, we’ve had those situations where clients are coming from a different state and they’re temporarily here during leave, or say, military.  We’ve supported some military spouses who take their leave time with family, so they’re having more support.  How does a doula interact with a mother or mother-in-law or sister or other people who are in the house?  Usually, that is more daytime, but sometimes overnight. 

Oh, absolutely, and I can speak on both.  My daytime clients and my evening clients have had mom come in, mother-in-law come in, and I find that the family members are very accepting of me being there, and I get along seamlessly with them.  They are encouraging mom and they’re asking me questions, as well, and a lot of times, they’re of the older generation, so they get it, if that makes sense.  They kind of understand different things.  I will be sharing things, and they’ll be shaking their heads, yes, yes, and how about this?  And I find that we all get along very well, and I’m very fortunate in that because it could be a struggle.  But the mothers-in-law are ready to give the baby up.  Oh, I had my few hours; we’re so glad you’re here, LaVita.  Here, take the baby.  

We never want to replace anyone’s role, and we care about what their goals are and what the partner or husband’s goal is and how we can better support them.  What the mother-in-law’s role is, or mother’s. 

Yes, and going in knowing that, knowing what my place is and not trying to overstep any boundaries, you know what I mean? 

Yeah, I feel like that’s so important and a question that partners especially have.  They don’t want to be replaced by a doula, and they want to get all of the baby snuggles and support and recovery and trying to help with feeding, if they attended a breastfeeding class with their partner or wife.  And so all of the things, but that is something that I get a lot when I’m doing matchmaking or when I work.  I haven’t worked as a postpartum doula in a couple years, but I’m still an active birth doula, and when I’m talking to partners, they certainly don’t want to be replaced at the birth.  They have those questions about, are there going to be too many people in the room, and am I going to have any role?  They don’t want to sit on the couch most of the time. 

They don’t.  They want to be actively involved.  And I love how our team – I’ve noticed that, as you mentioned earlier about the communication between the doulas.  A lot of times, I read it, and it may not be to me, but I find myself jotting things down because it’s so much good information that flows between each other and how well everyone works together. 

Yes.  Exactly.  So is there anything that we didn't cover that you would like to mention, LaVita? 

I believe we covered everything.  I would like to say that I love how you invite us and encourage us to do more trainings.  There was a training that we did when I first started with The NICU Doula, and I just wanted to let you know that I am taking her classes now to be certified as a NICU doula as well! 

That’s amazing!  So amazing!  Yes, Mary is excellent. 

She’s awesome! 

She has had her career as a nurse and is now helping doulas better support the families we serve.  Well, congrats on that!  I appreciate you taking the time and sharing your love for the profession.  We’re so thankful to have you on our team.  For our listeners who are local to West Michigan, you can hire or interview with LaVita and find her on our website.  You can also find us on Instagram at Gold Coast Doulas, as well as Facebook. 

Thank you so much! 

Thank you, Kristin.  This was amazing.  

IMPORTANT LINKS

Birth and postpartum support from Gold Coast Doulas

Becoming A Mother course

Buy our book, Supported